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The Rapture Issue
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CJ
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:55 am    Post subject:  Reply with quote

WHY is believing in a pre-trib rapture so dangerous?
The Lord led me to write this AGAIN this morning. It seems urgent.

I LIKE David Jeremiah!  He was preaching on Revelation.
He was excellent until he said, if you are a Christian, you wont need to make this decision
whether to take 666, the mark of the beast, you'll be in heaven!
That is the DANGER!  Jesus said we must ENDURE - TO THE END, not til an escape!

I was raised pre-tribulation rapture.  The Lord had to lure me away from that false teaching.
Missionaries told Chinese rapture teaching, and when the persecution came, they abandoned Christ.
NEVER NEVER ABANDON CHRIST!  He is our only Hope!

To teach rapture pre-trib is to send people to hell.  Its not a small thing.
This WARNING was not urgent in America until recently.
Now we live in Beast Day.  Beast NEWS, BeastTV, Beastradio, Beast govts, Beast laws.
Presidents and puppet propaganda BeastTV speak of globalism, one world as 'the answer.'

Folks, this is it.  This is the day pointed to throughout the word of GOD.
NEVER NEVER ABANDON CHRIST!  He is our only Hope!
Jesus said we must ENDURE - TO THE END, not til an escape!
Eternal Security doctrine for those who walk away from Christ is equally FALSE.
There is no 'back-slidden' - they are LOST
.


Last edited by CJ on Thu Jun 06, 2013 6:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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BornAgain2



Joined: 12 Dec 2009
Posts: 17194



PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got this in my email from Pastor Sam Adams in Florida
Top Five Proofs of a Pre-Tribulation Rapture
by Joshua Joscelyn on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 at 9:44am

#5: God would never let Christians suffer.
#4: Enoch. He was raptured before the flood that Noah went through.
#3: Scofield says it's pre-trib right there in the Bible.

#2: No mention of the "Church" in Revelation - only multiple mentions of the "saints" and "elect," whom we know to be Jews, because the Church doesn't go through the Tribulation, because they are not mentioned in Revelation, because the saints and elect are actually referring to Jews, because we know the Church doesn't go through the Tribulation, because they are not mentioned in...

And the #1 PROOF (drum roll) that the Rapture is Pre-Trib: You can go through the tribulation if you want, but I won't, because I don't want to.
recommended listening & PDF download:
Apostolic Premillennialism 1: Post-trib Rapture
http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1121081140

The Pre-Tribulation Rapture EXPOSED! Part 1a - The Dangers of Deception
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXT1kwVZJNE

The Pre-Tribulation Rapture EXPOSED! Part 1b: The Dangers of Deception
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwiM4P7kDNw

VERY good teaching here!
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CJ
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PROPHECY  *  True or False?
September 4, 2012  
I listened to a one hour audio of 3 men, here is my analysis - for what its worth.
Sept. 3  I listened to an entire hour of dire predictions.  I dont trust any of them.  This is what stuck in my mind.

MASS DEATH.  DEAD CHRISTIANS WILL DIE.

What do I believe?  There will be mass death, yes.  That 'dead christians' stumped me.
So many 'christians' are not CHRISTIAN, most churches dead, lukewarm, apostate, far from GOD.
If that line is from the Lord, and I am saying - IF it is, I think those who are spiritually dead but think they are saved will die.

WHO would the 'DEAD CHRISTIANS' be? My opinion - They are dead

-  if they do not HATE, speak out against all LIES, abortion murders of innocents and homosex activities.
-  if they do not boldly state Yeshua, the Lord Jesus Christ is the ONLY WAY.  John 14:6
Their fate after death is in the Lord's Hand.  Heaven or Hell?

Final note on that.  I just remember David Wilkerson saying - It will be the worst for the Catholic Christians.
Very FEW Roman Catholics are saved.  They seem terrified to even consider leaving that Satanic cult.
I URGE you to GET OUT - NOW - AND NEVER RETURN THERE!
You absolutely MUST be reading, believing and obeying the 66 books of the written word of GOD.


To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:  God says this:
I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot.  I wish that you were cold or hot.
So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.
Because you say, I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing, and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked,
I advise you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself,
and that the shame of your nakedness will not be revealed, and eye salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see.
Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, therefore be zealous and repent.  

Behold, I stand at the door and knock, if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
Revelation 3  hear means OBEY! Exclamation
http://nasb.scripturetext.com/revelation/3.htm

UNKNOWN Evils of the Vatican
http://cj.myfreeforum.org/about3523.html


WATCH  -  and  PRAY!
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BornAgain2



Joined: 12 Dec 2009
Posts: 17194



PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I don't buy much into the pre-trib rapture...

Apparently, some of the NWO minions like Benjamin Creme, Barbara Max Hubbard, high level Theosophists that Cutting Edge.org ministry founder David Bays has crossed paths with, among others, have said they anticipate "disappearnces" after their New Age "Christ" makes his appearance. Not sure if everyone here has listened to "New Order Barbarians" - a doctor who attended a private meeting with the then Planned Parenthood director in the 70's pretty much said the same thing when he spilled all of the NWO agendas(said that when this new system is unveiled, the "resisters" would just "disappear").

No, this is not something I endorse, but this is what THEY'RE saying. Either way, for the most part, what I really don't buy with the pre-trib theory is that it says the rapture can happen 5 minutes, a few days, or even a month or so from now before the AC makes his appearance. Scripture does NOT say this, and makes this clear...

2The 2:3  Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Dunno if there's a pre-trib rapture, but can't have the rapture until AFTER the AC makes his appearance. And when Bays attended that Theosophists meeting, they told him that the "disappearances" won't happen until after their "World Teacher" makes his appearance.

Let no man deceive you...
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CJ
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After the Tribulation
The Pre-Tribulation Rapture Fraud Exposed

Full Movie
Satan is working behind the scenes to set up a one world government and one world religion in preparation for the Antichrist. He has also deceived modern evangelical Christians into believing that they will be removed from this earth before the great tribulation takes place. This doctrine, known as the pre-tribulation rapture, teaches that Christ may return at any moment, and that there will be no signs of his coming. As a result of this deception, most Christians are completely unprepared for what the Bible has warned us is coming.

In this hard-hitting documentary, film-maker Paul Wittenberger (What in the World are They Spraying? and The Great Culling), Pastor Steven L Anderson, Pastor Roger Jimenez, and creation scientist Dr. Kent Hovind, prove from the King James Bible that the rapture will take place AFTER THE TRIBULATION but before God pours out his wrath upon this earth. They also expose Satan's plans for a global government and new world order.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTmZHDb_sP8&feature=player_embedded


Opposition to a New World Order is terrorist activity
Anti-Federalists who oppose a New World Order are potential terrorist threats.
The real terrorists are those who support the New World Order.
A new report from the CTC suggests that right wing political activists, not Muslims, are the new terrorist threat in America, and says that those who oppose a New World Order are potentially violent terrorists.

One of the groups this report warns of is the modern Anti-Federalist group, with people who believe the American political system has been hijacked by external forces interested in promoting a New World Order.

The CTC report says that these Anti-Federalists believe the federal government has become corrupt and tyrannical because of its intrusion on the civil constitutional rights of the American people and support civil activism, individual freedoms, and self-government.
They believe that the push for a tyrannical global government would result in disarming the American people and their violence may be directed towards the federal government itself and its proxies in law enforcement.

The FBI and DHS have already released documents which suggest that anyone who has coffee grinders should be reported to local authorities.
Photographers should be monitored for potential terrorism.

This CTC report suggests that all right-wingers are potentially violent and even loosely associates those who oppose a one world government with skinheads, Neo-Nazis, and the KKK, is only a small example of the growing paranoia over terrorism and the expanding surveillance state in America.
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/342686#ixzz2Jx6n17vP
http://www.thetreeofliberty.com/vb/showthread.php?t=178543


But none of the wicked shall understand [that the End of the Age is upon them.  Daniel 12:10
.
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BornAgain2



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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CJ wrote:
After the Tribulation
The Pre-Tribulation Rapture Fraud Exposed

Full Movie
Satan is working behind the scenes to set up a one world government and one world religion in preparation for the Antichrist. He has also deceived modern evangelical Christians into believing that they will be removed from this earth before the great tribulation takes place. This doctrine, known as the pre-tribulation rapture, teaches that Christ may return at any moment, and that there will be no signs of his coming. As a result of this deception, most Christians are completely unprepared for what the Bible has warned us is coming.

In this hard-hitting documentary, film-maker Paul Wittenberger (What in the World are They Spraying? and The Great Culling), Pastor Steven L Anderson, Pastor Roger Jimenez, and creation scientist Dr. Kent Hovind, prove from the King James Bible that the rapture will take place AFTER THE TRIBULATION but before God pours out his wrath upon this earth. They also expose Satan's plans for a global government and new world order.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTmZHDb_sP8&feature=player_embedded


Just finished watching it - first off, Pastor Steven Anderson is in gross error with salvation doctrines(wasn't mentioned in this film, but from previous sermons I've heard from him). With that being said - this is an excellent film, and an eye-opener.

It was also good to hear from Kent Hovind, albeit via phone. Looks like with all that time he's in prison(and not in the outside world going around making speeches and lectures), he's had more time to study the scriptures, and has come to the truth of this.

I'll admit, I myself have wavered every now and then going to this pre-trib belief nonsense. But the scriptures make it clear that the rapture doesn't happen until midway through the great tribulation AND the Antichrist has to be revealed FIRST. And there's a BIG difference b/w tribulation and God's wrath. Scriptures also make it clear that born again Christians are appointed unto tribulation.

What this film also cleared up was the dividing up of the 7 year trib - 1st half tribulation and 2nd half God's wrath.

Also, it's not just the "big whig" Christian leaders like Tim LaHaye, John Hagee, and various movies like "A Thief in the Night" that have heavily pushed a-heartbeat-away pre-trib rapture, but some of these smaller non-501c3 fundamental ministries I follow push pre-trib as well(I'm very surprised b/c pre-trib is being pushed by the same people that are helping push the NWO agendas).

And ultimately, when you look at it closely, the pre-trib position is no different it seems from the evolutionists beliefs...that pretty much life will just go on and on until you die so might as well live comfortably while life is short. Well...look at Christians in 3rd world countries like Africa, ME, and North Korea where they are persecuted daily, and their material resources aren't exactly "comfortable".

Mat 25:24  Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
Mat 25:25  And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
Mat 25:26  His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
Mat 25:27  Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
Mat 25:28  Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.


1Peter 4:12  Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:
1Pe 4:13  But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.
1Pe 4:14  If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.


1Cor 15:31  I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.
1Co 15:32  If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.
1Co 15:33  Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
1Co 15:34  Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.


1Peter 5:8  Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
1Pe 5:9  Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
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BornAgain2



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Post- Tribulation Rapture by Zac Poonen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbeUHdqBoWE

James 5:10-11
Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.
Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.
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Poppajoe



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kent Hovind Changes His Position on the Doctrine of Pre-Tribulation Rapture
June 2013
Dr. Kent Hovind, also known as Dr. Dino, man a who was unjustly put in prison for a sentence of 10 years, is one of my heroes. Once I heard saying something like, “Jesus can come any minute.” Today I was pleasantly surprised to read on his blog the following:

   My long time friend and Pastor, Steve Anderson and THOUSANDS of others (myself included) have come to realize that we “independent, fundamental, temperamental, right wing, radical, chicken eatin’, Bible believing Baptists” have been deceived about the rapture for the last 180 years! For 38 years of my Christian life I was taught and believed in the “pre-trib” rapture idea that was made up by a 15 year Scottish old girl in 1830! I just trusted the “prophecy experts” Quote from http://www.kenthovindblog.com/?p=1030

Isn’t this great news for Bible believers who know the truth about the Great Tribulation? We now have a respected name to drop on those who still believe the false doctrine that believers and receivers of Jesus Christ will be taken to Heaven before great tribulation sweeps the earth in the last days. People who hold this doctrine are willfully ignoring God’s Word that promises believers tribulation!
http://jamesjpn.net/2012/12/10/ke...trine-of-pre-tribulation-rapture/

Post-trib movie that Dr. Hovid is involved with:
http://www.afterthetribulation.com
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Lazarusty



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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rev 22: 18-19

I warn everyone who hears the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away form him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

Some claim this means don't take away from or add to the bible; however the bible as a book was not compiled at this point. It seems clear from the context, in particular with reference to prophecy and plagues in "this book", that it is referring to the book of Revelation, which if you look in the bible, is actually what this is called.

What is the prophecy in Revelation primarily about? The end times!

Therefore, extrapolating from this,anyone who preaches false end time doctrine, such as that we are going to be raptured away at any moment, will receive these judgments if they do not repent.

Preaching false end time doctrine is adding to and/or taking away from The Book Of Revelation.

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